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HonoredMule View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Sep 2010 at 21:47
Originally posted by Larry Larry wrote:

White quit because...it was exhausting, it was taking tons of time, Selon Far had a job to do and I went to college.

Now that that's out of the way, it'd be awesome if you guys could stop hijacking the story of WHITE to further your own political ends given your utter ignorance of who we were, what we did, and why many of us left.


Clap  I'm glad at least some of you are still around enough to set the record straight.
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Kumomoto View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Sep 2010 at 22:26
Originally posted by Brids17 Brids17 wrote:

Originally posted by HonoredMule HonoredMule wrote:

I will say it seemed very much the case that most of them simply came for the wrong reasons and didn't find what they were seeking.

I find this argument of what players are searching for quite dull. Players are searching for fun. If you're not searching for fun I have no idea what you're doing here. White obviously found what they were looking for because if they hadn't why on earth would they have invested so much time (and potentially money) into a game they weren't interested in? If you didn't like this game, would you have played it for as long as you have? You'd be lying if you said yes.

White played the game for as long as they did because they must have enjoyed something about it. Which means they quit because of something that happened in game not because they didn't get what they were looking for in it. 
 
You pegged it, Brids. Many (but by all means not all) White players really enjoyed something in Illyriad. They enjoyed being the "Bad Guy". Heck, it was even in Diabilito's original advertisment in the Eve forums to join his alliance that he'd show folks how to metagame and be brutal.
 
So these White players, many of whom are total carebears in Eve (and therefore sit around mining or doing other such tedious tasks all day in Eve) wanted to be the bully for once instead of being bullied. They joined White, Diablito quickly found them a target and they happily pounded all the newbie H? players. H? had a few of those newbies quit. It takes a while to organize and you can't protect all your newbies all the time. But organize we did, and suddenly, instead of being the bully, these select White players were getting their noses broken.
 
The thing they enjoyed, Brids, was the bullying, and when they couldn't do it anymore, they emoraged, threw their toys out of the pram and quit. Did it hurt the game? Yes. Could they have stayed on and negotiated a peace because, frankly, war is expensive and tough and it was hurting H? also, absolutely. Instead they chose to quit.
 
H? is excited about the new maps and is developing a variety of strategies to have fun with the upcoming releases. We, by no means, feel that we are invincible or unbeatable as an alliance. Quite the opposite. I expect other alliances to have the same population as H? within a few months. And then this perception will, hopefully, go away.
 
This game is totally up for grabs. I just wish our biggest competitor had had more staying power. No worries, the game goes on and, quite frankly, some of the up and coming alliances seem far more impressive than White ever did...


Edited by Kumomoto - 21 Sep 2010 at 22:45
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 00:16
Originally posted by KillerPoodle KillerPoodle wrote:

1) *You* did not receive a message from me - unless you wish to admit being the alt of Laccy, which would be inconvenient for him given that he already has an alt.

2) If you wanted to get away from the war then you needed to contact H?  Running away to another alliance does not escape you from the consequences of your actions.

3) It was all very fun for you while you were dominating noob players in H? that were a fraction of your size and boasting/laughing in alliance chat about your successes. But it's not so much fun now you're under the threat of being on the other side of things...

So, let me sum up - no apology, no attempt to offer compensation or even communicate, just run away and stick your head in the sand and hope we forget and when that fails throw in a couple of insinuations and a whiny attempt to gather public opinion.  Lol...


1. Yes you are right, *I* didn't got this mail from you.

2. You are right on this point too, It might have been smart to contact H?. But personally I don't think that whould have been a big diferents if you allraidy planned to punish me for my actions.

3. Donination noobs? LOL? The only H? members I attacked that wasn't up to my size was Emanem.. Only because I wanted to give our small members a break from to continous attacks from him. As you also know, and laughed about on chat, it took me about 3 or 4 days to get there. Enough time for him to place his military units and resources in a safe place. NOTHING was distroyed and NOTHING was stolen. I just gave our small members a break from his attacks.
If you can name 1 other H? members that I attacked (exept for Llyorn, who was alot bigger than me at that time) please tell me.

And I didn't want a public opinion about this all, I just wanted to give my own opinion on what was said here.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 01:02
KP you must be bored and I am sure that attacking defenseless White targets like Wuzzel is boring. I am sure you are after me, too. And boy can't wait for you guys to visit north-west.

But just refresh my memory. After I left Black I setup CowCorp in the middle of the map and was trading cows for horses and books with Waylander. You probably know that. Have you seen all the trades and gifts I have given to people? Kumomoto (your leader) definitely took a 40 saddle for 1 gold trade.

You guys are big enough and well-off than most others. I am sure you don't even need my stuff, but others do and that's what I have been doing.

Anyway, it is just shocking how everyone is scared of H?. You seem to be running a nice dictatorship here. I see how Goon ask you for permission to do something and other big players are unwilling to move because "H? hates interference".

Every empire goes down eventually, it is all a matter of time. You are just searching for an excuse to move your armies.

If compensation you are after, please, name it here in the forum. Let Illyriad know what Good players owe H?: I will take care of it as I have enough production to handle it. Let's see if this is what you really want.
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KarL Aegis View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 01:05
Seige is something done to players we dont want anymore, or we want their city for ourselves.
If you don't like the consquences of war, then you make friends by trading alot. Or be a nice guy on global or something. and its not like a seige is unbeatable. You have things called "stratagems" that make war more interesting. If you dont want a win all/lose all use the raid option. It chips away at an army so its easier to make the final push against that player.
I am not amused.
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Laccy View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 01:25
Originally posted by Larry

White quit because...it was exhausting, it was taking tons of time, Selon Far had a job to do and I went to college.

Now that that's out of the way, it'd be awesome if you guys could stop hijacking the story of WHITE to further your own political ends given your utter ignorance of who we were, what we did, and why many of us left.


Clap  I'm glad at least some of you are still around enough to set the record straight.

Hear hear.  Clap

edit: sorry, i misinserted the quote posts


Edited by Laccy - 22 Sep 2010 at 01:27
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KarL Aegis View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 02:34
Was this thread about the cost-benefit ratio of war or how WHITE and H? went to war with eachother?
Money makes the world go round people! Think about economics. If you get rid of a player that steals from you, you benefit in the long run. If you're the agressor, you only benefit until you get seiged to the ground.
Makes war seem simple.
Quit whining.
I am not amused.
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 02:50

I want to add one thing.

The ability to siege is important and should always remain in the game.  Here's why:


I played another game similar (but far inferior) to Illyriad.  But in that game, you could not siege anyone. You could only destroy their troops and loot their towns.

Well, I eventually realized that players could simply hide their resources, ship them town to town, and retreat their armies and there was no way for me to punish them.  So I quit that game because I was annoyed there was no feature to 'truly kick ass'.  I felt like it was too carebear.  And it was frustrating when trash talking started and there was no way to really settle it.


While a fine line has to be drawn,  (slower sieges make sense because the option TO knock people out of the game is there but it should also take time so allies or others can defend the person in jeopardy), the ability to siege should never be removed.  Or players might quit -- looking for a more satisfying fight elsewhere.


my 2 cents



Edited by Grunvagr - 22 Sep 2010 at 02:52
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Brids17 View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 04:43
Originally posted by Larry Larry wrote:

Now that that's out of the way, it'd be awesome if you guys could stop hijacking the story of WHITE to further your own political ends given your utter ignorance of who we were, what we did, and why many of us left.


I apologize. That was not the story that I had heard.

Originally posted by Jargas Jargas wrote:

1. Give us, the players, something that we can hold onto.
    a. Original, or main town cannot be sieged and taken.


This could actually work. It would stop players from moving resources and troops from one city to another to protect them and it would still be a blow to the player however it wouldn't kick them back to the very start of the game either.

Originally posted by col0005 col0005 wrote:

Ok the problem is that we need siege to be devastating but not game ending, what if we changed it so that cities could be forcefully moved but only partially destroyed.
Ie military buildings  and trade, mage tower, consulate etc can all be destroyed. However resource production buildings, storehouse, flour mill  etc cannot be harmed. So loosing a siege will destroy a players ability to interact with the wider world for a short time.


Perhaps the idea above combined with this idea. Your main city can't be destroyed but your barracks, mage tower, consulate, etc, in your main city could be.


Lastly, for all those who are arguing about H? and White please go here: http://forum.illyriad.co.uk/the-bitter-sea_forum14.html The sub-forum exists for a reason people...
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Kumomoto View Drop Down
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Direct Link To This Post Posted: 22 Sep 2010 at 15:21
The problem with making original towns unconquerable/unrazable is that you can't knock someone out of your area. It is also totally unrealistic. Here you can basically destroy them, thoroughly wipe out their army, have your troops basically using their castle as a latrine and you can't make them go away?
 
One thing that folks aren't necessarily focusing on is that when your capital gets relocated, you do NOT lose your research. The time limiting factor for building a city up is the research (given unlimited prestige). Therefore, you could really quickly rebuild a city if you have all the research...
 
As someone said above, the game would not be fun without consequences and risk. That's what makes people care about their actions...
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